YAS Podcast: Selena the Stripper Episode #3 Transcript
Selena the Stripper, on your dad’s zipper. Faer intellect and forethought puts most people’s to shame. Selena is one of the greatest storytellers in the stripper community. With faer own podcast, Heaux in the Kneaux, fae has plenty of experience getting faer millennial voice to be heard. Selena has been stripping for a few years now, and part of the topic was baby strippers, what’s it was like for faer and what it’s like for the next generation coming in.
*This transcript was auto-generated and may contain minor errors.* Begin transcript.
AM: So before we get to our guest, I’d like to talk about my thoughts for the week. I’ve been thinking a lot about baby strippers and millennials and the younger generation, and about how important their role is in society today. I think one of the things that bothers me the most.
How people now talk about the younger generation is they, they put them down a lot and they, they basically say things like, oh, millennials think this, or, oh, millennials [00:01:00] feel privileged. Quite honestly, I think millennials are actually really, really amazing and they bring up a lot of great points and I think they’re a lot more educated than we are, um, when we were their age.
And I think that has a lot to do with social media and the internet and them just having more. Access to more information. And the reason why these people are so important is because they’re breathing new life into society, and especially baby strippers. They have the power to breathe new life into the strip club industry, which is a complete fucking mess right now, if you know.
Anything about what’s going on in the strip club industry. And I think that by working with Baby Strippers and educating them and you know, moving forward with the types of movements that sex workers are doing now that, you know, we can make a real change in what’s going on right now. So, you know, I would like to encourage all of you to really take a moment before you talk negatively about the next generation.
Do hear that a [00:02:00] lot. A lot of shit talking about millennials and baby strippers, and I think that this is a time to actually unify with them and to create something new and interesting and healthier and we’re just like shit talking each other, especially the younger generation. We’re not doing anything good for ourselves either.
So I would like to encourage you to embrace. The next generation and to work with them and stop talking shit about them. Okay. Alright. So thanks for listening to my thoughts. I, I don’t know what I would do if I didn’t have an audience to rant all of my beliefs and, um, mental musings too. So thank you for.
So I don’t wanna waste any time. I wanna get right into who our amazing guest is because guess what? She’s kind of a baby stripper, but she’s a very mature baby stripper. And today we are here with Christiana, AKA, Selena.
Selena: Hey.
AM: Hi.
Selena: Hey. What’s up?
AM: Thank you so much for coming. [00:03:00]
Selena: No problem. Happy to be here.
AM: Yeah.
You know, I took a video of you walking up to the door. Oh really? Today? Oh yeah. I was pointing and shooting. You just look so fabulous. Like right out of Austin Powers with your white, like patent leather boots. Thank you. It’s amazing. Thank you. Yeah. Um, I wish I had like the capacity to like dress up so beautifully.
Every time I see you’re. So stylish.
Selena: Oh, thank you.
AM: Yeah,
Selena: I’ve been getting into being stylish. I feel like people in LA kind of show up really hard, and I’m like, let me just try.
AM: That’s true. That’s true. You know, I went out Saturday night by accident. I didn’t realize what night it was until I was out and everyone was so fabulous and like hot.
Mm-hmm. And I was like. Wait. Oh, it’s Saturday. That’s fine. Yeah. And like you’re right, everybody like was turned up looking so good.
Selena: Yeah, I think I just, I appreciate it because I come from Oklahoma where it’s very schlubby like all the time.
AM: Wow.
Selena: Like it’s standard to go to a club and like [00:04:00] sweatpants and a sweatshirt.
Totally. And a boots type vibe and a hair in a ponytail or like. Top-notch bun, like Yeah. And that’s, that’s totally cool. You have a full face of makeup on and that’s your look.
AM: Yeah. Yeah.
Selena: But here, I like everybody really, you know, showing up.
AM: Yeah. You grew up in Oklahoma?
Selena: Yeah,
AM: I was born there.
Selena: Really?
AM: In still water.
Selena: Oh my gosh.
AM: I mean, I only lived there for six months, so I don’t really remember any of it.
Selena: Mm-hmm.
AM: Yeah. But, well, that’s
Selena: cool.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: Still waters. Nowhere.
AM: It’s such
a,
Selena: I mean, well, I guess it’s where OSU is, so that, like that’s the second Oh, definitely biggest university in Oklahoma.
AM: And I know that because my dad had an OSU hat forever.
He, he didn’t go there. He’s just like sports and stuff. Um, but I think he went to Naval Bootcamp there and that’s why we were there.
Selena: Really?
AM: I think that’s where they had bootcamp.
Selena: Huh?
AM: There’s, it had something to do with the Navy. There would be no other reason that we would be in. Still water.
Selena: Yeah. Yeah, definitely.
It’s truly nowhere.
AM: [00:05:00] Yeah. And there’s a place in Oklahoma where you get these drinks called lunchboxes. Do you know what I’m talking about?
Selena: No.
AM: And they have dollar bills stapled all over the walls in the ceiling.
Selena: Hmm.
AM: Um, and it’s in Oklahoma City. I forget what it’s called. Every time I always forget.
Selena: I have no idea
AM: we’re where
Selena: this place is,
AM: but I have to go now.
Yeah. Someone needs to comment. Yeah. Yeah. And so lunch tell us boxes are like, like less than half a glass full of light beer. Okay. With a splash of orange juice, and then you get a shot of amaretto that you drop in.
Selena: Okay.
AM: And it tastes like fruit snacks kind of slash like maybe a cracker in there because the beer is like, yeah.
It’s really good.
Selena: It’s got that hoppy
AM: mm-hmm.
Selena: Thing plus the fruity.
AM: Mm-hmm.
Selena: Very interesting.
AM: It is, it is.
Selena: I’ve never heard of this. I like that. I’m learning about where I’m from.
AM: Yeah. Yeah. I know more about Oklahoma than you.
Selena: Yep.
AM: Uh, that’s the case. Yeah. I’m kidding. So, you know, I just wanna be like really honest with our audience.
Um, [00:06:00] Selena and I, I prefer to call you Selena. I’ve just kind of That’s fine. That’s
Selena: fine. That.
AM: Um, we both work on soldiers of pole together.
Selena: Yes.
AM: Yeah. That’s how we
Selena: know each other.
AM: Yeah. And you are now officially on the board.
Selena: I’m on the board
AM: of Soldiers of Pole.
Selena: I’m the merch maven.
AM: Oh my gosh. You make the most amazing merch.
You have such great ideas.
Selena: Thank you.
AM: Yeah. But I think that comes with like, you know, you are of a younger generation and you just have like your finger on the pulse when it comes to that kind of stuff.
Selena: Yeah. And, um, I mean, I, I’m from. An art background and all. So I went to art school and so all my friends are like artists doing things.
So I’m just like, Hey, like what are you doing? I give them a call and like,
AM: yeah,
Selena: can you do this graphic design thing for me? Awesome. Can you like print this shirt for me? Can you do photo editing? And people are like, yeah, yeah, of course. I love to,
AM: yeah. I love being friends with artists.
Selena: Yeah.
AM: Yeah, they’re amazing.
They’re
Selena: fantastic.
AM: So tell us, tell the audience how long you’ve been stripping now.
Selena: I’ve been [00:07:00] stripping so. It’s been about. Three consecutive years. But then I had, um, a time prior that I was dancing as well. Um, and that was before I left for Brazil and then before I moved to California. So
AM: Okay.
Selena: After college I would like stripped for a couple months and yeah.
And then I used the money and traveled.
AM: Okay, so you used the money to go to Brazil?
Selena: Yeah. Yeah. I was like, oh, I need to have enough money to like be out there for 12 months and. You know, provide for myself. And I was like, okay, so if I make X amount of money, it’ll be worth three times what the value is in the United States.
So I need to make this amount of money to survive comfortably. Wow. Yeah.
AM: Wow. So you basically created a business plan for yourself?
Selena: I did.
AM: To go And you were right out of college?
Selena: Yeah.
AM: So you’re still young?
Selena: Yeah.
AM: Like 21.
Selena: Oh no. I was, um, I was like 22, 23.
AM: Okay. Still pretty young.
Selena: Still pretty young. Yeah. I was still a little thing.
AM: Yeah. And so [00:08:00] why Brazil? Was it just. Just for funsies or was there
Selena: Um, it was a little arbitrary. I definitely wanted to learn Portuguese. Okay. And Brazil was the place. I also just had like a romantic love of Brazil. Gotcha. And I just thought, let me just do it. I wanted to ruin myself. I had this thing, I was like, oh, your neuroplasticity diminishes significantly by the term you do turn 24.
So I was like, I need to leave the country so that I could pick up a language with a greater ease, uh, before I turn 24.
AM: Dude, you’re like blowing my mind right now. Okay, so you, first of all, you researched science and biology, right? And then you, you figured out how much you needed. You created a business plan and you executed your plan and you took yourself to Brazil.
Selena: Yeah.
AM: For a year.
Selena: Yeah.
AM: Like that’s sick and yeah. Wow. So I think, you know, the, one of the reasons I’m mind blown in that like, I think it’s important for the audience to hear this is because so [00:09:00] often people think that strippers are just dumb or we’re just like dancing to make money so we can, um. Pay for our drug habit, our children or school and like that.
Or a luxury
Selena: lifestyle
AM: or a luxury. Yeah. Yeah. And like that’s it, you know? Yeah. Um, and you know who, um, Valerie Stunning is, right?
Selena: Mm-hmm.
AM: Valerie Stunning is very like, best friends with Jack Stripper
Selena: Uhhuh.
AM: I should definitely introduce you to her via Instagram. Yeah, yeah, totally. Like follow her because she talks a lot about like the business aspect of stripping and how to save your money and, and how to hustle and like the mental roadblocks that we deal with.
And she really encourages people to, you know, love stripping, but also utilize. Stripping for what it really is for, which is to make a shit ton of money and do the right things with it.
Selena: Totally. Yeah. I mean, I’m like an obsessive saver, um, just because I grew up in like really extreme, well, not extreme poverty, but I was super poor and so I’m just like, I am [00:10:00] gonna save so much so that I can like, have the mobility to do what I want.
Yeah. And I also know like. As much as I, I love stripping it. It does have like, you know, like a finite kind of end to it at a point as much as you can strip for like decades and like, you know,
AM: yeah.
Selena: Be fucking hot and make a lot of money and get better and better like over a period of time. But like, there are things like injuries that are real.
Mm-hmm. And also just. You know, like maybe you just feel you wanna do something different sometime.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: It’s like we’re changing growing people and what we want changes as much as any other person in any career. Right. So, you know what your point of focus is is always going to be changing. So I think for me it’s important to, to save and, um, just like, you know, keep that in mind.
Like keep it in mind that I’m gonna change and. Want something different.
AM: Yeah, totally. When I was younger and I was like 23, stripping like [00:11:00] you, um. I, I wasn’t as smart with my money. And I look back on that time and think like, dang, you know, if I had had the, the intelligence that I have now or the experience, how different my life would be.
And then of course you can’t do that. Right? You can’t live that. Make, leave past that you’re making up. Yeah. Um, but yeah, and that’s why I’m. So like fascinated by the younger dancers now who know more of how to do that?
Selena: Yeah. I mean, I think it’s, it’s uneven. Um, I mean everybody, we have all of the things that we have to fight against, you know, like I love luxury stuff as much as anybody else.
Sure. Like, I wanna be traveling all the time and taking breaks and,
AM: yeah.
Selena: Um. I’ve been spending so much money this month, like just shopping. ’cause it’s like sales season.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: So I have like a little guilt inside about that. I’m like, oh, but I don’t. You know, like I, I still can save and that’s important to me and I get a [00:12:00] really good feeling out of it.
But, you know, like I still think a lot of younger generation people don’t save, unfortunately.
AM: Right,
Selena: right. I mean, I think also people don’t, it’s not that they don’t realize that it could, like, that they’re not always gonna have that money with that same frequency, but it’s also just like. There’s a lot of extenuating circumstances, like people have maybe, uh, unstable living conditions.
Yeah. Or maybe they’re taking care of their families or
AM: Yeah.
Selena: Things like that, you know, so they’re not always able to, or they don’t have the mindset to save.
AM: Right. I, that was me miss missing the mindset. And then I did save, and then I invested in the wrong thing and lost it. And my mentality was, I’ll just make that 20 grand back and like.
Two or three weeks. No big deal.
Selena: I wish I was bawling that hard.
AM: Yo, back in the day though.
Selena: Yeah,
AM: it was different. It
Selena: was different money then.
AM: It was very different money. So [00:13:00] when I first started stripping in 2002
Selena: mm-hmm.
AM: Um, I was like. Fuck man. I make a grand easy. Like this is what’s up. Yeah. And, and then the older strippers were like patting me on the head like, oh you poor thing.
We used to make two or three grand a night easy. Mm-hmm. This is not, this is like stupid money. Like they were irritated by only making a grand. And I remember being like, oh man, you know, I got started too late. Mm-hmm. And now making a grand. Like alm, like every night I had to make a grand. If I didn’t make a grand, I was pissed.
Selena: Mm-hmm.
AM: And now I’m making a grand every night. I mean, really, depending on where you are, is. Pretty tough.
Selena: Yeah. I mean, I feel like I still, I get kind of upset if I don’t make a grand in a night too still, but it’s just like, I mean, that’s not typical, like what I make is not typical nowadays.
AM: So you’re, you think you’re above the average?
Above average one?
Selena: I think so, yeah. Okay. Unfortunately, yeah. I mean, especially considering [00:14:00] like what we do and the risks that we have and
AM: yeah.
Selena: Just, you know, how the money ends up spent on things that you don’t expect, like,
AM: yeah.
Selena: Health things like mental health or physical health? Mental
AM: health. Mental health.
Yeah.
Selena: PT from time to time like
AM: Right. Yeah.
Selena: That kind of thing.
AM: Yeah. I need a massage right now actually.
Selena: I do too. I really do.
AM: Like for real? I was using the tennis ball a lot this morning.
Selena: I keep putting it off. ’cause you know, it’s easy to deprioritize my own physical health.
AM: Right.
Selena: Like that way
AM: Right.
Selena: With a massage that feels like less. Important than going to yoga or something.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: But it’s like they go hand in hand.
AM: Totally. Um, so I wanna talk a little bit about the climate in Los Angeles ’cause you work in an area that I don’t get to talk to a lot of people in the area of LA that you’re working in
Selena: Uhhuh.
AM: Um, ’cause I’m, I’m Hollywood. I’m a hood rat, so I spend most of my time over here. Um, but do you feel [00:15:00] comfortable talking about like what. Is going on in some of the issues that you’re seeing currently?
Selena: Yeah,
AM: of course. And where you’re at.
Selena: Yeah. Um, so my club is unique. We’re close to the airport and so, um, we have like a special kind of niche there.
Has like a place that’s like close enough to airport hotels and stuff like that. The people who are in transit, um, can stop by. For however long, like people wait out flights or they come from a flight directly to the club ’cause they wanna like blow off steam or whatever. We have like a consistent stream of like traveling clients, which is really positive because people who can travel, have money to travel.
They’re often put up in hotels and they have nowhere to go in that area because that airport is. An area is desolate. Mm-hmm. It’s just like nothing but warehouses. So they’re kind of like, we are the only entertainment option for them out there. So we have really a cornered market and we also have been there for decades.
It’s like one of [00:16:00] those spots, but I mean it’s like la like all of the strip clubs have been used in 1,000,001 movies and, and music videos. Yeah. So we have like this kind of iconic like thing about being here, but um. To speak to the politics of it. My club is interesting because, um, we’ve managed to dodge a lot of the regulations, um, around AB five.
So the bill that changed us from, um, independent contractors to employees. And, um, so we are still currently classified as independent contractors, although I have heard with new girls that they have the option to opt into being an employee or independent contractor.
AM: Hmm. And they haven’t approached any of you that are already working there.
So not at also opt And to be clear, the AB five bill, it, it, uh, for anyone who doesn’t know what that is, it makes it so that on a federal level that strippers are now considered to be employees. [00:17:00] When in actuality, and I think there’s some confusion around that language as well, even strippers are saying, oh, the law has changed.
The law never changed. It was just reworded. It was rewritten and we’ve always should have been classified as employees. But because that 20 questionnaire thing, have you ever read that?
Selena: No, I haven’t.
AM: It’s like 20 questions. To figure out whether if your workers should be classified as independent contractors or employees.
Yeah. And it was very vague and it created a lot of gray area uhhuh, which is why I think these establishments were able to get away with that for so long. ’cause it was always like when you took the test, you’re like, Ooh, am are they, aren’t they? Mm-hmm. And they’re like, well, we’ll just do what’s easier for us.
Selena: Yeah.
AM: And so I think that’s why they went that route. But now AB five makes it so that on a federal level, um, we are definitely classified as employees. There is no gray. It is black and white now. On
Selena: a federal level. Yeah. Or on a Oh, really?
AM: Well, on a state level state, but I think it’s red. And maybe I’m quoting wrong, but I think that it’s recognized by the federal government or [00:18:00] something like that.
Selena: Okay.
AM: Am I being wrong?
Selena: Um, I’m not a hundred percent, but it sounds like state government thing. I think it’s state by state.
AM: Okay.
Selena: Mm-hmm.
AM: All right. Well, you’re probably right. ’cause you,
Selena: I don’t, I’m just,
AM: you seem like you read more books than me, so I think you might be right. We’ll fix that later if I’m to, if I’m wrong.
Selena: Um,
AM: yeah.
Selena: But
AM: I know it’s, it’s definitely solidified
Selena: things a lot more for us. Yeah. I mean, a big part of it was just that. The question boiled down to like, is your job integral to the identity of the business?
AM: Exactly.
Selena: So what’s a strip club without strippers? What’s Uber without drivers? What’s, you know, rider, what’s a news agency without riders?
AM: Right. Right.
Selena: So all of those levels and we are, you know, literally there’s no club without us.
AM: Exactly.
Selena: So that’s how we are pushed to, we are employees.
AM: Yeah. So do you know of any of the dancers opting for employee status?
Selena: No. Not all, not one. And I, and I’m pretty sure that with any kind of hiring, there’s a lot of pressure to [00:19:00] sign documents in a certain way.
And I think a lot of dancers coming in are not reading through it to, you know, to navigate their own contract. Mm. I know whenever I sign mine, I mean, it’s like a document that’s like 10 to 20 pages of stuff really of, of legal language. So, um, I mean there’s like stuff that you can glance through, like, oh, like your image, like Will or will not be used in publications or what da da you wanna do.
Um, like you must wear this kind of thing and you must be there for these hours. And there’s this punishment for not using, for not being on stage when you’re called and blah da da. All of those. Things
AM: Punishment.
Selena: Yeah. So that can be like, you might have to pay a certain amount in your tip out or whatever, in house fees if you are not on stage and you’re called twice for your set or whatever, that kind of thing.
Or like if you refuse to do like a showcase special or something,
AM: Ooh, you get penalized for not doing a showcase special.
Selena: Yeah. There, there can be. And it’s, I mean, it’s [00:20:00] like also, so if in the event that you’re. Contract is terminated. Um, I have talked to one girl in particular who, um, so I, so she was like, why did I get fired?
And the management told her that it was because she wasn’t tipping out properly. But then whenever I talked to management about the issue and I was like, why was she fired? I was, I was wondering, they. They were like, oh, it’s because she’s crazy. You have no idea how crazy she is. She also was breaking all kinds of rules, like not going on for showcase and things like that, so they.
Use that kind of minor infraction as a way of skirting around saying what they’re actually firing you for
AM: Sure. So are your showcase specials is like what I used to do at Spear Rhino, which is. Where you all go up on stage and walk around the stage, like essentially, we used to call it a cattle call.
Selena: Yeah, you do. Like a little [00:21:00] lady parade. I call it the sushi conveyor belt.
AM: That’s a good one. Girl. I used to avoid those so hard. Oh yeah. I hated them.
Selena: I like to hang out in the bathroom if I can.
AM: Yeah. Yeah,
Selena: it’s just, I mean, it’s like, I get it, I get that it’s a useful promotion device to kind of be like, okay, so now buy something.
And sometimes I use it to my advantage, like if, if a customer is talking my ear off and I need to get away, then they’re like, oh, it’s showcase. I’m like, oh, well I guess I gotta go. And now I come back and I like, I guess it’s time for me to ask you for this dance. Yeah, they’re making me do it. But it’s still like, you know, it’s, it’s annoying.
AM: Yeah. But you, you do bring up a really good point. Like it is useful in some ways, but it’s just so gross in another way, you know? And I know I used to do it too. Mm-hmm. You know, I did it plenty, like hundreds of times. Yeah. But I hated it. I hated it.
Selena: Mm-hmm.
AM: Um, so you, how do you feel, like, what do you think about baby strippers and [00:22:00] coming in and not really, because are you.
The way I see it, the climate right now in LA is really messed up. Um, and there’s a lot that, that could be different.
Selena: Yeah. I mean it’s, it’s a really difficult climate right now. Yeah. ’cause of the, um, just. The way that clubs are interacting with AB five. Mm-hmm. And it’s not because they have to, because there’s no reason that they have to enforce it this way.
They’re doing it in a way that. Becomes extra cumbersome and punitive toward dancers.
AM: Mm-hmm.
Selena: Um, because they want us to personally petition to have it repealed so they make it as uncomfortable for us as possible so that we don’t realize how it could be a benefit to us to be employees. That we have power to greater rights.
You know, like we [00:23:00] have, we could have healthcare and we could. Unionize and we could have like collective rights, you know? Mm-hmm. Like we can work as a group and we don’t, we can’t be fired for, um, taking collective action together. Mm-hmm. In a way that previously as independent contractors, there was no protection.
AM: Right.
Selena: And there was no one, no reason for them to pay us hourly. Even if, you know, a lot of girls work a whole shift and maybe they don’t make a dime because. The club is just, you know, maybe clubs are failing, some clubs are failing.
AM: Right.
Selena: Or maybe it’s just the wrong day, or maybe it’s just, you know, a club is not promoting itself properly.
AM: Right.
Selena: Any number of reasons.
AM: Right.
Selena: So now at least girls can come in and be guaranteed that they’re getting a wage.
AM: Mm-hmm.
Selena: So like there’s all of these possibilities, but the way that clubs are enforcing it, they’re making us feel as though this is a negative thing and hoping that we will use our power.
Yeah. Or what we were granted and not realize it. And, you know, petition to [00:24:00] have fewer rights. Right. And to have access to fewer things.
AM: Yeah. Do you see younger strippers coming in, um, and just not knowing anything about the history or where we are now? Like what, what’s. Because I, I’m not stripping anymore, so I don’t get to see the newer generation.
What can you
Selena: say about
AM: that?
Selena: It depends. It depends. I mean, there are definitely a handful at all clubs of, of girls who know what’s going on, like. We, I think we’re doing a pretty fun job of, um, creating interesting media. Like we have great meme groups. Mm-hmm. And we have the dancer locker room, and we have dancers resource, and we have people like Jack the Stripper out there, like making fun content and all kinds of like, cool ways that we are framing the narrative.
Mm-hmm. And talking about what’s going on in a way that has never previously been accessible to dancers.
AM: Right.
Selena: So some people are, you know. Are experiencing that they’re picking [00:25:00] up that media and they’re coming in with that kind of under their belt, like as tools that they have. Um, but a lot of girls are not.
It’s still, you know, as much as, as ever before, it’s been a thing where, you know, we have like tears of dancers being aware of things. Like there’s people who didn’t really have much of a choice in the situation who are coming because they have, you know, desperate situations or they. Just, you know, they don’t know where else they can work.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: So there, there’s that level. Then there’s people who do know what they’re getting into and are willing to do it, and they’re fine with that, but they’re not trying to make moves. There is like the kind of educated class of strippers who, you know, they know what. Right. They’re, they’re pursuing other things at the same time.
Um, and they are down for whatever causes. Yeah. And there’s just like older strippers who have different experiences and they’ve seen the decline of clubs and they have their [00:26:00] own weight in with it. And maybe, you know, like. I think there’s also like a lot of pressure to stay where you are if you’re an older stripper, because you know it’s a hard climate right now.
AM: This who’s gonna hire me?
Selena: Yeah. Who’s gonna hire at 40
AM: years
Selena: old? Who’s gonna hire you at 40 years old? Or who’s gonna hire me with all my tattoos? Or who’s gonna hire me with what? This and that, you know? Right. My short hair.
AM: Right.
Selena: So it’s, there’s always gonna be such a diversity of people in the club.
AM: Sure. Well, it sounds like what you’re saying is that strippers are people.
Selena: Yes. We’re not a monolith.
AM: Nice.
Selena: Yeah.
AM: Um,
Selena: I know it’s surprising.
AM: Yeah, I know. Um, have you seen the hustlers movie yet?
Selena: Yeah.
AM: You did?
Selena: Mm-hmm.
AM: I’ve been avoiding it.
Selena: Yeah. Really?
AM: I need to see it. Well, ’cause there was this one, I was listening to this one, um, review
Selena: mm-hmm.
AM: Um, on this, um, NPR show and they were talking about. [00:27:00] This. Oh yeah.
Jesse Rims strip club scene. And they were just talking about how interesting it was, how the dancers at the end of the night were like taking off their shoes and talking about how, like, what they were gonna do when they got home after work. And I was so irritated by that dialogue. They’re
Selena: like, they, they think that they just roll us into a carpet and stick us in the closet at the end of the night.
I always, I always joke with clients that way. They’re like, oh, where are you going after this? I’m like, oh, back to the closet where they keep me.
AM: That’s amazing. I would get, they would say, oh, oh, what do you do during the day? I am like, oh, I, I get my nails done and I go tanning. You know, I like, I get, I like sleep in and, you know, because they, they, it’s almost like that’s all we do
Selena: think, they think that you’re just like a princess kind of.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: You know,
AM: like all I do is like just
Selena: prepare and up, pamper up and prepare all day and get beautiful all day.
Yeah.
AM: Yeah. That’s all I do.
Selena: It’s really,
AM: yeah. Um,
Selena: it’s so funny.
AM: Yeah. Well meanwhile it’s the opposite. We do a [00:28:00] million amazing different things. Mm-hmm. So speaking of that mm-hmm. Um, I was on your show
Selena: Yes.
AM: Po in the Know
Selena: Yes.
AM: With my partner Antonia Crane.
Selena: Yes.
AM: And had such a fun time with you guys. It was
very
AM: fun.
You and your sister Clover. Yeah. Um, can you tell us a little bit about your podcasts and some of the topics that you discussed?
Selena: Yeah. Um, so Ho and the No is a podcast about sex work by sex workers for sex workers, and we talk to sex workers across all different disciplines. So it could be people who are pro doms and people making porn, cameras, strippers, cuddlers.
Um, massage parlor workers, um, full service escorts, street based sex workers. Everybody.
AM: I really love this list. You just rattled off. Can you write that list down for me one day?
Selena: Yeah, of course.
AM: Yeah, because I get asked a lot. You know what it, what? Classify as a sex worker. Mm-hmm. And so I’d like to ask [00:29:00] you that question, like be, obviously you have this list.
Mm-hmm. And a lot of people wouldn’t consider strippers sex workers, not even strippers themselves.
Selena: Definitely. I think that’s a big division line with a lot of strippers is they don’t wanna be considered sex workers.
AM: Mm-hmm.
Selena: Because they’re not providing full service.
AM: Mm-hmm.
Selena: But I mean. We are definitely sex workers.
AM: Yeah. I looked up the definition of sex worker. I was looking on Wikipedia, uh, where everything on there is true.
Selena: Mm-hmm.
AM: Awesome. The,
Selena: the real beacon of knowledge facts.
AM: Um, and one of the things that it mentioned on there, and I kind of, I wanna go back and read it again and I wanna research this a little bit more, but it was mentioning that even the people who work in the facility of where the sex work.
Is provided are also considered sex workers.
Selena: Very interesting.
AM: Mm-hmm.
Selena: But I think I kind of get it because there is this real, especially you see in the the stripper world because it’s like one of the few forms of legal sex work that the people who work in strip clubs also [00:30:00] carry a lot of the stigma.
Like they don’t have as much. Ease and changing jobs, you know, like, oh, they tend to stay, stay within strip clubs.
AM: Yeah, you’re right.
Selena: There’s, and there’s like a secrecy around what they tell their families and things like that. Like they have a lot of the kind of secrecy, uh, that we have to. Bear, of course, they’re not doing like the same levels and like with all sex work, there are degrees, you know?
AM: Right.
Selena: Like sending, taking erotic nudes and, and making soft core porn is not the same as like being a street based sex worker.
AM: Right.
Selena: Who does full service,
AM: like Right.
Selena: There’s, we can’t just, you know, it’s not. The same thing. It’s not the same tier, but it is under a similar, it’s under the umbrella.
AM: Totally.
So are those the types of things that you discuss on your show, like the different tiers and, and types of sex work and
Selena: Totally. Yeah. Um, so it’s that, um, we talk about life, labor, politics, the really nitty gritty [00:31:00] of like what your workplace looks like. What is your office. Yeah. If you are a sex worker, um, ’cause that’s kind of how I’ve been calling the strip club lately in my office.
AM: Office. I mean, yeah. That’s where we conduct all of our business.
Selena: Exactly. It’s, it’s my place of business. Yeah. Um, and we also take a dip back and talk about history. All of our, uh, historical sex workers, our historical hoes as we call them.
AM: Mm-hmm.
Selena: Um, which is also kind of funny because I had a guest recently, um, a male porn star who was like, I don’t know if I wanna be called a, a hoe.
Like, I don’t know if I’m like a, a hoe. And I’m like, oh, that’s really interesting. Like, what about like, man who, things like that. It’s like, okay, well it, yeah, the man in there, then it works for me.
AM: Oh, really?
Selena: I know he had to add a little like gendered caveat for him to Oh.
AM: Because it just, being a regular whore was like too much for him.
Selena: It was too gendered a term. He didn’t, he felt it was a conflated with the feminine whore and he didn’t wanna be under that umbrella. I don’t
AM: know how I feel about that.
Selena: I, I mean, I also, I. I [00:32:00] contest this for sure. I don’t think that we should be dividing each other in that way as well. Especially who to horror, you know?
AM: Yeah, yeah.
Selena: It’s like I consider myself to be a, a historical hoe. I think what’s important about my show is giving historical significance to people who are historically significant. Mm-hmm. I think that we don’t have a cultivated history in the same way that a lot of other professions do. And I think that definitely it’s important to talk about it.
Yeah. And to create an archive of our experiences and talk about our work and kind of like, you know, we have, we can have like a kind of database understanding of this is, this is sex work.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: The big umbrella that we all
AM: Yeah. Hang out under. Yeah. That’s so interesting. So who’s your favorite historical hoe?
Oh,
Selena: that’s hard. Um. Uh, I guess I. I guess I’m gonna go for an easy one ’cause it’s off the top of my head. But, [00:33:00] um, Clover recently did a historical host segment on Air Force, Amy. Okay. Are you familiar with her?
AM: No, I’m not.
Selena: So, um, she is like a full service sex worker and she lives out in, um. Vegas. And she actually, she kind of like, runs, is like more of a madam slash house mom amazing.
Of this brothel out there. And she’s just like super cool. Like she started off, did like military service for a while and then came back and wasn’t sure what she wanted to do and decided to get into sex work. And now she like mentors younger, younger, um, full service sex workers and stuff like that. And she’s just like.
Really cool. I wish I, yeah, you should check out the episode on that.
AM: Yeah, I would love to.
Selena: Yeah.
AM: Yeah. So how can people find out more about your podcast?
Selena: Um, you can find us on Spotify, apple Podcast, Stitcher at, um, ho in the Know, so H-E-A-U-X in the K-N-E-A-U-X.
AM: Cool. And we’ll have that information definitely, totally, like listed for you [00:34:00] properly with a link to it for sure.
Yeah. Um, yeah, I just, I I love that because you’re right, our history is sort of. It, it’s non-existent and very little has been documented because people are like. Afraid to talk about us. I, I don’t know, like, you know, is it, and
Selena: I think especially with contemporary sex workers too, because older ones you can kind of get like the history rundown of them.
AM: Mm-hmm.
Selena: Um, but of course, like a lot of the knowledge that we have about sex workers from the past is like carceral knowledge. Mm-hmm. So. Write-ups from their prison record or things like that. Like when they’ve been detained. When they’ve been tried for whatnot. Yeah. Like it’s, it’s interesting how they kind of go hand in hand.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: But, um, horse of your, if you’re not familiar, um, is a great like, resource for. Learning about all kinds of sex workers across history. They have a fantastic timeline that I very, oh, I need
AM: to read that
Selena: very thoroughly. Read through all the time. I’m like, oh, I need a historical hoe. Like, let me just read through this timeline and yeah, pick somebody out from it.
[00:35:00] So I
AM: need to read that.
Selena: It’s so fun.
AM: Yeah. So with, you know, it has bothered me recently that even strippers themselves are like, I’m not a sex worker.
Selena: Mm-hmm.
AM: Um, and.
With the pole dance industry right now, there is a divide between pole dancers and strippers, even though strippers are the inventors of what pole dancers are doing. And, um, you also pole dance as a stripper. Yeah. So not all strippers pole dance and not all pole strip.
Selena: Yeah.
AM: Is how I explain it to. In layman’s terms to a civilian,
Selena: it’s a Venn diagram.
AM: Yeah, totally. Um, what are, what’s your, I just really briefly want your thoughts on like the, the, the current divide between pole dancers and strippers and what you think about that.
Selena: Um, I mean, for me it’s just, it’s hard. I feel like it’s appropriation because, um, I feel like. There’s just, um, [00:36:00] well, I guess there’s opportunity for allies and all of that, but I think a lot of right now, not enough is happening because people just don’t want to understand the amount of discrimination.
And, and other kind of like marginalization that we face as stripper pole dancers.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: And also like, you know, strippers made pole dancing to be real. Like if you’re using the metal pole, the spinny metal pole, and you’re wearing the platform pleasers and whatnot. And if you’re doing those things like you are taking from our lineage.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: And I think it’s really important to acknowledge that and also to do more as an ally, because we need a lot.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: We need advocates in all levels of, um, government and also legally, and we need writers. We need artists to work to help bring us up. Mm-hmm. So that we can bring up the broader sex work community as well.
Yeah. It’s like [00:37:00] we have the greatest opportunity to have real kind of, we have mobility in a way that other sex work industries don’t because we’re legal.
AM: Mm.
Selena: You know, like we can, we can have access to. You know, better workplaces and we can have our, um, sexual assault allegations properly, you know, um, handled properly.
Potentially.
AM: Potentially Not in all cases.
Selena: Not right now. Yeah, not right now, for sure. Right. But it’s like we need a lot of stuff. We need that. We need help. For people to take us seriously. Mm-hmm. You know, to take all of our labor concerns seriously, and our health concerns and our sexual assault concerns seriously.
AM: Right.
Selena: And I think that part of that is like being a good ally if you’re in the poll community, because you are like so directly connected to us of any group.
AM: The pole dancers. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. Wanna be fabulous. Just like these strippers. Pay attention. It’s [00:38:00] stripper tips.
Selena: Okay, so my first stripper tip is for strippers particularly, and that is to really, um, economize your time.
I think that it’s important whenever you’re making a sale to a client to keep it under five minutes if you’re talking to them. Have five basic questions and I can tell you my basic questions.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: What’s your name? Where are you from? How’s your day been? Sometimes I don’t even get past those three questions because like where you’re from, like that brings up a whole like, oh, you’re from Idaho.
What do you do out in Idaho? Blahdi blah.
AM: Mm.
Selena: You know, like that kind of thing. How is your day? So you kind of get a vibe of like how they’re feeling.
AM: Mm-hmm.
Selena: Um, name. You can also like kind of vibe off of that, but it’s just like, um, what are my other ones?
AM: Other
Selena: questions. Oh. Oh, what do you do? So, oh yeah. So you know what their income level is.
AM: Yeah. Yeah.
Selena: And also if you’re asking what do they do? Like there’s a big difference between like, oh, I am an electrical engineer versus I’m an aeronautics engineer, [00:39:00] versus I am a whatever, like a mechanical engineer.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: Their pay grades are vastly different. So it’s important to kind of parse through, like, you know, what kind of money people are working with, even though,
AM: do you know the average income of all those different types of engineers you
Selena: just listed?
I. Uh, so kind of like I know who makes more than others. Okay. So, so that’s what’s important to me in, in a way, so,
right.
Selena: Um, yeah. And then I think that, that, and then after that it’s just like, do you wanna go for a dance? Sure. May I take you for a dance? I like to take
AM: you for a dance.
Selena: I always say, may I take you for a dance?
Oh, that’s nice. Or may I take you,
AM: that’s a nice one. That’s nice. I used to say,
Selena: oh yeah, I say that with my ba. All the ba.
AM: Yeah. Yeah. It’s so funny that you chose engineers because that used to always be my favorite answer from them when I’d say, what do you do? Because they always, engineers have money and they’re more willing, they always seem more willing to spend it [00:40:00] and to part with it for some reason.
Selena: Totally.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: Lawyers may haggle you. It depends on the kind of lawyer doctors. It’s like, you know, it’s gonna be different if you’re like a family physician versus like a surgeon of some kind. Totally. Like,
AM: yeah,
Selena: surgeons are gonna be coming in with the baller money, but just because somebody makes a certain amount of money doesn’t necessarily mean that they’re willing to spend it.
AM: Right. Totally.
Selena: So it’s,
AM: it’s, the engineers love to
Selena: spend it, but it’s good, it’s good to kind of have a ballpark thing. Like if you find out that a guy’s. You know, working in food service maybe. Right. You’re not gonna, don’t spend as much time, you know.
AM: Right.
Selena: And also, I mean, not that you should be spending more time than five minutes, regardless of whatever their income level is.
AM: Right.
Selena: You know, make the sale as soon as you can because if you go too deep, then you become too human and you ruin the fantasy. Right. Like, the point is you’re cultivating this fantasy of yourself.
AM: Mm.
Selena: Or of whatever identity you have.
AM: Right.
Selena: So it’s your, you know, hyper femme, super, [00:41:00] um, what is the word?
Charismatic version of yourself.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: And you don’t wanna go too deep into your family history. Don’t talk about your kids.
AM: Oh god, no.
Selena: Don’t talk about the problems of your day. Never admit that you’ve even having a lesson Amazing day.
AM: Right.
Selena: Like, unless it’s a regular regulars, you know, the rules are different.
Yeah. You’re gonna roll how you’re gonna roll and you have a relationship. But with new people, those are my, my ground. My five.
AM: That’s great. Those are some good sales. Sales tips in general. Yeah. General sales tips.
Selena: Mm-hmm.
AM: Yeah. And strippers are the best salespeople I’ve ever met.
Selena: Oh, totally. Yeah. I mean, we do it naked and
AM: Oh yeah.
Selena: With people who look down on us.
AM: Mm-hmm. Yeah, you’re right. Yeah,
Selena: like there’s such a social stratus and we’re kind of. The lowest rung, but we have to perceive ourselves as the highest rung, even among these people who are professionals in all levels, you know? Yeah. All kinds of fields. Like we get NASA engineers coming in
AM: 100%
Selena: and like, you know, [00:42:00] you gotta be like, I’m better than them.
AM: Well, they’re
Selena: kind of, and they owe. They owe me for this. Yeah. Experience.
AM: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, those are great. That’s great tips. Thanks. I love that. Get ready for our rapid fire question round. It’s time for four for one. How do you sleep at night
Selena: Soundly?
AM: What’s your fake real name?
Selena: Selena,
AM: but that’s your fake name?
No. Like your, like if they’re, if you give them Selena. Oh, do they say
Selena: Alana?
AM: Okay. Okay, good. I knew it. Um, I’m not gonna ask you that one. Uh, have you ever used a strap on
Selena: Yes.
AM: What’s the dummies thing you’ve ever done?
Selena: Uh, twisted a guy’s nipples and made fun of his little baby dick.
AM: That’s good. How often do you wash your work thongs?
Selena: Uh, trick question. I work naked.
AM: Oh, that’s good. My answer is [00:43:00] once a week and I work three nights. I used to work three nights. Is that gross or what?
Selena: You rewear them.
AM: Fuck. Yeah. I didn’t care. Yeah. I switched ’em out a lot. It’s not like I wore one pair all night. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Yeah, they were like switching all out.
Selena: Oh, you, I mean, I like that you wore so many outfits. I was always like,
AM: yeah,
Selena: when I worked at a clothing, a clothed club, I would wear the same thing all night. ’cause I was like, fuck it. I don’t care enough to change.
AM: Yeah. Yeah.
Selena: But I mean, I’d wear that outfit like once and then wash it.
AM: Yeah. Oh, once and what now?
No, girl. I wash my dance bag once a week.
Selena: A good question is how often do I wash my garters?
AM: Okay.
Selena: And the answer is whenever I remember to,
AM: the garters are just the ones around your leg, right?
Selena: Yeah, just around my leg thigh.
AM: Well, that’s not,
Selena: they get smelly.
AM: Oh, do they?
Selena: Yeah, totally.
AM: Oh.
Selena: And so whenever I start smelling them, I’m like, oh,
AM: time.
It’s time. Oh, wow. Okay. All right. I’ll add that to the list for the next time.
Selena: Cool.
AM: All right. And tell everyone again how to find you on Instagram and your [00:44:00] podcast and all
Selena: that stuff. Okay. Yeah. So my podcast is Ho in the Know, and it’ll be in the bio. Um, you can find me on Instagram at Pretty Boy Girl. I have a Patreon account and that has exclusive stories of, um, things that I do at the club and outside of the club, my out calls and all of that.
There’s a lot more than you get on the gram.
AM: Really?
Selena: And it’s, yeah. So it’s primo content. Yeah. So you can, uh, subscribe at the Real pretty Boy girl. So at Sign The Real pretty Boy girl. Um, yeah. So please check that out. It costs as little as a dollar to subscribe.
AM: Wow.
Selena: Yeah.
AM: Your writing is amazing by the way.
Thank you. Yeah. I’m like sucked in when I start reading your posts on Instagram, I’m like, what’s gonna happen next? Yeah.
Selena: Oh,
AM: incredible. And so you read the
Selena: pineapple juice one?
AM: No, but I’m going to. Okay. I, I saw one of your posts, they’re like, make sure you read the end of this story. Yeah, that’s the one.
And I’m pretty sure that’s the one.
Selena: Yeah.
AM: Um, but yeah, I’m sorry we didn’t touch on that more, but your writing is just fantastic. And a lot of that is based on your experiences inside the club, [00:45:00] right?
Selena: Totally. Yeah.
AM: Yeah, I just love that.
Selena: Yeah.
AM: So thank you for doing that ’cause it’s very entertaining.
Selena: Yeah, it’s good.
I also had a really great, like, I had a great comment from one of my friends at the club and she’s um, I think she’s Ukrainian and she was like, oh, I love reading these stories. It’s good for me to learn English.
AM: Oh, that’s great.
Selena: And I was like, I love that.
AM: Yeah.
Selena: I love that she’s a sex worker and she’s like, you know, she’s learning English and by reading your stories, you know, feeling like solidarity too by reading my stories.
AM: Amazing.
Selena: Yeah. I love that. Very heartwarming.
AM: Well, thank you so much. I just, you’re just so bright and intelligent and brilliant and I’m just so like, excited to watch more of your journey as we, ’cause we’re working together now and it’s been so much fun, like really working a lot more closely with you in the last.
Few weeks, so I really appreciate you doing this with me. Yeah. So thank you. Thank you
Selena: for having me on.
AM: This is so
Selena: fun.
AM: Yeah, of course. Yeah, and I’d love to have you back sometime too. Yeah. Have me back
Selena: sometime.
AM: Definitely. Definitely. All right guys. That’s pretty much it. Thanks for watching our podcast [00:46:00] today.