YAS Podcast: ViVi Fierce #141 Transcript
In this episode of YAS Podcast, formerly Yes, a Stripper Podcast, host Daisy Ducati and her co-hosts discuss the impact of recent laws affecting sex workers, particularly focusing on the new regulations in Sweden and the Interstate Obscenity Deficient Act in the US. They speak with ViVi Fierce, a trans sex worker and performer based in Los Angeles, who shares her journey from homelessness to empowerment and community support. ViVi highlights the misconceptions about trans sex workers and talks about her work in the nonprofit sector, providing essential services to marginalized communities. The episode touches on the challenges faced by sex workers today, the importance of community, and staying informed in the face of increasing censorship and legal battles.
*This transcript was auto-generated and may contain minor errors.* Begin transcript after opening credits.
AMD: Hey everyone, it’s AMD here, your host of today’s episode YAS Podcast with producer and homie Daisy Ducati. What’s up, Daisy?
Daisy: Hey. Hey.
AMD: How you doing today?
Daisy: Awesome. It’s gonna be a good day.
AMD: Okay. I hope so. If you say so. I believe you. Okay, good, good. Well, I wanted to talk to you about something and like make sure it’s on everyone’s radar.
Um, it’s not a [00:01:00] good day in Sweden right now. Mm-hmm. And so I just, you know, I just wanted to talk about it and like, I personally got a little confused. I thought they banned porn altogether, but that’s not the case. The Swedish government banned making custom videos and porn for like OnlyFans.
Yeah.
Daisy: And cam.
AMD: And
camming. Okay. Of course. So you can’t do camming anymore either.
Daisy: Yep.
AMD: Okay, so you can’t purchase it and you can’t make it?
Daisy: I
believe
AMD: I think that’s what it is. So what really got me though, did you hear this, that the Swedish government was like. Oh, like all of these letters from these supposed sex workers couldn’t have been written by sex workers because it was so intelligently written.
And if you, you say you’re not formally educated, how are you smart enough? Like you’re overlord [00:02:00] must have written this. ‘
Daisy: cause sex workers can’t possibly be literate.
AMD: I was
like, completely
shocked.
Daisy: Come on.
AMD: And this woman is standing at the podium saying these words out loud, because at first I’m like, come on, they can’t be saying this.
And then I saw it on Instagram and I’m like, you know, it’s upsetting.
Daisy: Yeah. It’s, it’s infuriating. Yeah. And like, what does this law mean for those of us that make that kind of content but don’t live there?
AMD: I think
Daisy: like what if I were to sell a custom video to someone who lived there?
AMD: I think that they, they would get in trouble for buying it from you because it’s also outlawed to buy it.
Daisy: Yeah.
AMD: So, but you don’t live there, so you would be, you just wouldn’t get in trouble, but they would if they got caught and like, how are they gonna police it?
Daisy: Yeah, I don’t.
AMD: Okay, and so to just like kind of add on to [00:03:00] that, then here in the US we have the Interstate Obscenity Deficient Act, introduced by Mike Lee, a Republican in Utah.
That seeks to broaden the legal definition of obscenity under federal law, potentially leading to a nationwide ban on pornography.
Daisy: And this one, it’s not just gonna be like what we think of as porn, but also like anything they think of as porn, which could be like sexual health things. It could be,
AMD: oh
yeah.
Daisy: Anything to do
with being gay or trans, like, oh man.
AMD: But then also like what about the movie industry? I get hella turned on sometimes. Yes. I’m just watching a regular movie.
Daisy: I just had to turn a movie off the other day ’cause it showed like really graphic scenes of teenagers fucking
AMD: Oh.
Yeah, I don’t know.
I don’t know how they’re gonna force this shit. And I’m honestly, I’m, I see this stuff and I’m like, oh, right. That’s why, that’s why I wake up and do this work [00:04:00] every day because we gotta talk about this stuff. We can’t stop talking about it and informing each other, you know? It’s just mm-hmm. Crazy. And I, I’m gonna end with this before we bring our guests in the room.
They’re coming for all of us. If they try to take porn away, think about the millions and millions of people who lose their choice. And it’s like, we’ve been telling y’all, if you don’t listen to us, they’re coming for you.
Daisy: And it’s not just about porn, it’s about censorship, it’s about privacy, it’s about a lot of things.
AMD: All the things. So if you are not a sex worker and you’re listening to this. You need to really think about that and stand with us and take action when we, when we tell you to. ’cause this is no joke. Like, yes, they’ve tried this before, but they’re just gonna keep chipping away, which is what I feel like Sweden is doing.
Let’s just chip away just like they did with abortion. So everyone’s just gotta pay attention. That’s all.
Daisy: Yep. [00:05:00]
AMD: All right. I’m done talking about that. Thank you for indulging me. I mean, we gotta talk about it. I know, I know. It’s so horrid. Um, well, what is not horrid and was beautiful and exciting is our next guest, and I’m so, so excited to talk to ViVi today.
So we’re gonna bring ViVi fierce into the room.
ViVi: Hi.
Hi everybody. Hi.
AMD: How are you doing today?
ViVi: I’m doing great. Um, it’s a really easy morning, um, just recovering from feeling ick, but
AMD: yeah. Um,
ViVi: I look beautiful. I feel beautiful, and that’s all that matters.
AMD: You do
look beautiful. You do. And, um, you are in sunny Los Angeles, am I right? Mm-hmm. About that? Yeah.
ViVi: So, yeah.
AMD: Can you like, kind of tell us what you have going on in Los Angeles and like. What everyday life for ViVi is like. But first, really quick before I forget, what are your pronouns?
ViVi: Um, so I just, uh, use she [00:06:00] her pronouns.
AMD: Perfect. And do you identify as a sex worker?
ViVi: Um, yes.
AMD: Lovely.
ViVi: I, um, I do, I will say that like.
I’m in the less, um, like sex work is a spectrum. Mm-hmm. And like, um, I used to be more full service and like online content creation, and now I’m just more so of like a dancer mm-hmm. Within the scene that also still tries to support my girls. So Yeah.
AMD: I love that. Thank you. Thank you for sharing that with us.
So yeah, like tell us what life is like, what, what are you got going on, what’s your everyday, like, what’s Los Angeles like for you? I know you’re, you’ve moved there, so give us a background.
ViVi: So, um, like right now, everyday life for me right now is kind of just like working. I’m like, I work a lot in the nonprofit field and so I am actually a resource navigator.
So what I do is I help link people to care. So, um, yeah, so basically people will message me and, um, [00:07:00] request like, um, gender affirmed care or housing or anything like that, food assistance. And I just send them like links in different areas and flyers to different events that have those resources. And that is like my nine to five. So I did go from like sex work and stuff to a nine to five work. And what’s great about it is that like a lot of my lived experience from being like homeless in the past and sex work and stuff come in, um, to come so like. It comes in clutch at the end of the day, whenever I really need to do my job and like really bond with people.
But outside of that, I’m also like a dancer. I do, uh, go-go dancing. I’ve done, uh, like pole stripping and I’ve even done like drag and all that. Basically if, if there’s a stage and you’re about to, uh, you’re willing to put me on it. I I’ll do it. I’ll do it. That’s the thing. I’ll even do comedy if I gotta like girl, I just love, that’s what I love about LA and that’s what like drives [00:08:00] me and it is like really sunny all the time.
I will say we have been getting a lot more like cold front and stuff lately.
AMD: Yeah.
ViVi: I’m not gonna complain about it. I’m a big girl, so, um, like for me it is just a pleasant like, um, breeze within the sunny days of LA
AMD: Yeah.
Yeah. That’s really amazing. The, the nonprofit work that you’re doing, how, what was that transition like for you from sex work into the nonprofit sector?
Because that’s, that’s kind of a big change to go from like doing whatever then to like, whatever, based on time right Then to a nine to five. What was that like?
ViVi: So for me, sex work was more so like surviving, like while I was homeless and getting back on my feet. And the moment, um, I finally secured housing and stuff was whenever I really started like looking for work that was just a little bit more sustainable for me.
’cause as a big girl, like sex work is very different than, um, like girls who are thinner [00:09:00] and all that. So. Like just a lot more like crap to like dig through till you get to the gold basically as a big girl. And so I found serving and stuff until I had a friend who was in nonprofit give me that connection and I got an interview, I whi up my resume and stuff.
Um, and yeah, and I got the job. And I will say it was so much nicer getting an office job than a serving job or like sex work just because like for. I do enjoy meeting people, but I like meeting people on kind of like my own terms. And I feel like with, um, sex work, um, you just, like, sometimes the people are just really, eh, really nasty and, um.
Same with serving, but like with this kind of work I’m running into people within my community and people like who need help and stuff and it’s just a very different interaction. So yeah.
Yeah, that was, I like
- It’s, it’s been easier for me, but like I can see how it can be hard. ’cause I will [00:10:00] say it’s the nine to five aspect that’s hard for me being in an office from nine to five, literally.
Drives me crazy a little bit. Yeah. And I love that we get a work from home day and our weekends, but still, girl, like I get it. Like I get why my friends don’t wanna do it. I’m like, I get it.
AMD: Yeah. Yeah. That’s wild. Yeah, I, I think about that. My partner actually has a nine to six and I see him every day, like, and it, it’s a little different for him.
It sounds like with you, it is like a little bit more hands-on and probably really fulfilling. You know, like it does it, does it give you a sense of purpose? Like how does that feel?
ViVi: So, I will say, especially when I started, it really did give me like a sense of purpose and feeling. But I’ve realized that like my life as just a human, as a black trans woman, like.
I spend it so much like either hiding when I was younger or um, [00:11:00] busy trying to like transition like during the early age, uh, ages of that to like this work. It’s just constantly giving. And so while I do enjoy it and I do love the work that I do, I do think that like, it can just be a lot for anybody.
It’s because it’s a lot of, it’s a lot of, uh, sad stories. It’s not really a lot of like happy cases, like you’re helping people with real problems, and I think that as time goes on, it can get real draining. Because I used to be the social butterfly. Um, and then college kind of nixed that and I became a lot more chill.
Mm-hmm. And then as I, um, became homeless, that switched me and changed me into like, you know how when we were kids, we were like, oh, I never want to be like an adult and I hope I never changed like that homelessness did that. And it kind of like changed that like whimsical, like childlike wonder in the mind to like, things are way more serious and you have to like focus.
AMD: Yeah.
ViVi: So
yeah, like. [00:12:00] Basically I miss that and I think that all of these experiences in line of work, while they are fulfilling and they are like great to the human experience on like building my character. I’m tired. Yeah. But yeah, at least I’m pretty,
AMD: yeah. I, I mean, you’re gorgeous. Yeah. I love that. At least I’m pretty, I’m gonna That’s hilarious.
Can I start using that?
ViVi: Yeah. Like literally, that’s what I say. Like I’ll sit there and I’ll be like, I’m so tired, but at least I’m pretty, at least my skin’s clear. I’m like, okay,
AMD: I love that. So, you know, as someone who. Has, you’re trans and, and you needed support during a time. You’re mentioning houselessness and things like that.
So now that you’re doing the work yourself to help other people, like what kinds of support do you think that trans people, especially trans workers, trans sex workers, really, really need, but they don’t often get.
ViVi: Um, I definitely know that housing is, [00:13:00] um, a struggle across every community. It’s including the sex worker community.
I’m like finding stable housing that will like, allow you to like, stay home because for some reason in LA like people don’t wanna rent to people that work from home. And I’ve just like, it’s so, it’s crazy. You have to like jump through so many hoops. And then on top of that, I’m like, with the cost and like rise of everything.
I’m like, I know that like food Food and, um, just financial like help is what’s really needed within like the trans communities and sex worker communities. And I know that with sex work communities like Prep and HIV, like prevention and stuff are so important and that’s being attacked right now. Like, I literally, um, at our job we’ve gotten like, we’ve had our like funding affected by stuff like
AMD: Sure.
ViVi: Like what’s going on in our, uh. Office right now. So yeah, like I feel like what, what people really need right now is housing, food, and finances. And unfortunately that sounds [00:14:00] vague, but like it’s just the reality of the situation. Everyone is like going hungry. Everyone is like scraping by and
AMD: Yeah,
ViVi: like, and for the girlies that are doing sex work, like sometimes like one month will be really good, but then like one month will be like extremely bad and I’m just like.
It used to really not be like that. It used to be a little bit easier to like, yeah, figure it out. There was also a lot more spaces for us online. I’ve realized that like, yeah,
I can’t
even like post a titty pic anywhere anymore. I’m just like, I have to send it to, like, I have to send it to, um, to my friends via text because I just, I’m like, where do I, where do I post it?
AMD: Where do I
even put this? And I totally get the urge to be like, someone has to see this picture. I, you know.
ViVi: Thank
you.
AMD: Um, I do, you know, so I worked, I lived in Los Angeles for 22 years. Mm-hmm. And I danced in the clubs, in the strip clubs and the nude strip clubs, bikini, topless, all of them for 18 and a [00:15:00] half years. And I totally know what you mean? It used to not be like that. Like there the money was just flowing and it was a lot easier.
And then over time it just got worse and worse and, and I know exactly what you’re saying. Some months it’s obviously this is totally different than doing work on the streets, but I think that there’s a parallel in the, like what is happening in the economy there. Right. And that it was mm-hmm. So much better at one point, and then it just, I don’t know, like Los Angeles as far as sex work just kind of fell apart.
I don’t know. You probably, when did you get to Los Angeles?
ViVi: I got to Los Angeles in 2019. Okay. But I will say, I don’t say that I was fully living in LA until like, um, 2021, whenever I finally got like, secured housing. Yeah. Because being homeless, it was just such a blur.
AMD: Sure.
ViVi: Yeah. So
I wasn’t focused on [00:16:00] friends.
I, I didn’t have community, I didn’t have anything. I stayed to myself. So, yeah, like. So if there were things like falling apart at that time, I just didn’t notice because I was struggling.
AMD: Yeah, it was before that. It was definitely before that. I think things started to get weird in like 2012, 13, like it’s, it gradually got slow and then I’ve even noticed living there that the houselessness increased.
So much. And I know you’re saying like they need food and housing and it sounds vague. It doesn’t, to me it sounds like a staple. It’s like the most important things to living and like living in Los Angeles and seeing that firsthand all the time for many, many years, it was heartbreaking. And watching it get worse was even heartbreaking.
And I would just like, I would go out of my way to bring food to people on the streets. ’cause it’s like. It’s, it’s so like we all have to fucking eat I, I, I can’t imagine
going through that and then [00:17:00] you, you’re like living through it every day. So I like really commend you that it’s such tremendous work that you’re doing and that you turned your lived experience into a way to help other people. It’s really, really beautiful what you’re, what you’re doing.
ViVi: I think that the biggest thing that I look at is, um, I didn’t have help whenever I was homeless, right. And looking for resources. A lot of the places, like a lot of the things that I would try to do kind of led me in circles. So, um. That’s kind of the thing now, like I tell people exactly like if you need an EBT card, this is what you do.
This is what you say. Yeah. I’m like, if you need this, this is what you do. This is what you say. I’m like, at the end of the day, I’m like, people have to get over their, like their pride, their ego of the situation that they’re in, and you’re gonna have to admit thanks to these people that make you feel like hopeless and pathetic and stuff, but at the end of the day, you’re just going on a hard time.
AMD: Yeah.
ViVi: And um, I think that like having that knowledge now is, is, [00:18:00] it’s so useful for me because like I can lead people directly to where they need to be. Right. Because I hate whenever you like try to look for a resource and you go online and it’s so vague.
It’s like, oh, just email this and then you might not even get an email back. It’s ridiculous.
AMD: Yeah. That, that must be really frustrating to experience that. Um. And so you’ve come out of so much. You know, your life really seemed to have turned around from what it was to what it is now, and you’re so full of spirit and energy.
Um, how do you take care of your spirit? Like, you know, living in a time right now that we’re living in and, and continuing to do the work that you do, that can be challenging at times. Like, how do you take care of yourself and, and with everything that’s happening in the world and everything that you have going on in your life, I.
ViVi: I spend time with friends.
AMD: Okay.
ViVi: That’s the easiest thing I spend time with community. Um, and I will say it’s hard to go out to all these shows and all [00:19:00] this because like, it’s just exhausting, especially with all this work I’m doing. But I love inviting people over. Um, I love playing like board games, card games, video games.
AMD: Nice.
ViVi: Just like coming over, like having a drink, just talking, watching movies. I love watching like the Anna Nicole Smith show with friends. I will invite people over and we will, I even got season two. So like I will sit there and like invite people over to watch the hard to watch season two and like that’s how I heal.
I sit there and I lean on friends community. My, um, roommate who is my best friend for like 10 years, I call him my gay husband. Um,
AMD: nice.
ViVi: He’s someone that I always like, lean on and hang out with whenever I need it. Um, but yeah, that’s. Really what I do, and also I do my skincare. I’m like,
AMD: you
do, what
do I do?
ViVi: My skincare. Oh, your skin care. So that’s another thing. Care, do your skincare okay. And do a feel better. Take your shower, do your skincare. That is, I always told myself like, well, homeless. I was like, I know that I’m never going to like. I’m never going to like be so over [00:20:00] like so defeated that I’m gonna end it all because I do my skincare.
I’m like a girl that does her skincare is obviously a girl that is prepared to fight another day and
AMD: I love that.
ViVi: It’s true.
Yeah. I
love, and that’s kind of how I keep my spirits at.
AMD: That, that’s really nice. Uh, hanging out with friends and community. I call that blue zoning. Um, I mean, not that I made up the term blue zone, but I like to say blue zoning when I’m like with community, making food, doing fun, nice things because it’s just like it feeds our, our spirit so much and it helps us live longer.
Like literally, I think there’s been studies. Have you heard of Blue Zone? Do you know what I’m talking about?
ViVi: Um, I haven’t heard of Blue Zone, but like it’s interesting and I’m definitely gonna look it up.
AMD: Yeah.
ViVi: I just,
because the thing is, that’s literally what I do. So like, yeah. I just didn’t know there was a name for it.
AMD: So
it’s a, it, it’s in reference to like parts of the world and some parts of the world are considered blue zones and it’s where, and those zones are where people, one of the characteristics is that [00:21:00] people spend a lot of time and community around each other. So I just use it like. Casually like, oh, we’re blue zoning today.
Very silly.
ViVi: That’s very helpful though, because like I really do wanna travel and stuff around the world, especially with how our climate and stuff is. But
yeah,
I’m sitting here thinking, I’m like, I bet there’s a list of like blue zone places. And I’m just like, if that’s the case, I would love to go there.
AMD: Yeah.
ViVi: I would love to go and like, share meals with people who are like friends and Yeah. Who are just open to that. That’s sounds nice.
AMD: Yeah. You should look it up. Definitely. Definitely. Speaking of other parts of the world, um, you’ve said before that we’re living through, uh, Nazi Germany parallels. Mm-hmm.
How does that awareness shape the way you move through the world, especially as a performer and a sex worker?
ViVi: It makes it so hard, um, and difficult because I’m gonna be honest, I love the bimbo aesthetic. I love living in it, but it’s hard to live in it because it’s [00:22:00] problematic to sit there and turn a blind eye to everything.
And so, and that’s the, that’s one of the most, that’s the main thing about being like a really good bimbo is that like. You turn it off and you turn it on. And so I’m like, with that being said, I’m like, how do you do that in a world where kids are dying and people are suffering and trans people are being eradicated and all these things?
I’m like, it really is hard to turn it off because if once I do, I become a part of the problem. So it really has made it hard to work. It’s made it hard to live because. Um, the difference between, uh, like, uh, Nazi Germany back then and now is that like we have phones, we have internet, we have, so like everything that’s happening in our office, in our government, around the world, it’s getting like doc- reported on by real people.
It’s being analyzed by real people and like it’s literally being proven false. Like whenever our president or or something says something [00:23:00] and claims it’s the truth, it literally is fact checked within minutes and we have it on our fingertips that it’s false. They didn’t have that back then, and so that’s what makes it even crazier, why everything is still happening the way it is.
Because like the parallel was similar with how back then they did target a trans, um, center that had all this knowledge and um, on surgeries and all these things, and they destroyed that. And that’s what they’re trying to do here right now in America is just, just to destroy that, to like label all trans people as like a fetish.
So like whenever they put out those laws that say that like, um. Those anti-sex and porn things in public laws, you could just snatch someone like me right off the street with no questions, me just sitting there fully covered, like drinking a coffee. Apparently that’s, uh, showing up in fetish and apparently that’s what they wanna make illegal and um okay to just like snatch you up off the street. And that’s crazy to me. And it’s so similar, so that’s [00:24:00] what makes it even more insane, but like, you have to find the balance of being in the moment in real life and trying to find and create space for your happiness and trying to stay aware.
AMD: Yeah, I hear that. I, I feel that way too about like what, you know, like I. What more could I be doing? You know? Um, and then I have to remind myself like, you’re already doing it because there’s so, it’s like so heavy. It’s like if I’m, I feel like if I’m not in the trenches, then I’m not doing enough. Like I can kind of pile on this self guilt and then I have to talk myself out of that and remember to focus and keep doing this work, but also pay attention at the same time. I’ve never experienced so much chaos as an adult before like we’re experiencing now. And to your point, why are these still these things happening when we know these things have happened before and we’re [00:25:00] literally documenting it as we go? Like, I mean, I don’t expect you to have the answer to this, but what is that?
How, why, why do you think that happens?
ViVi: Honestly, I feel like whenever it comes down to it, everything has been, um, is the word, uh, commodified or whatever it is, where everything has a price tag now. Mm. So basically everything in America is like based around capitalism. Like from healthcare to our kids to like even going outside and breathing and it costing money. Like of course the 1% who gets richer off that are going to keep that going.
But like for me, like I’m confused ’cause there’s actual studies that show that like once you hit a certain amount of money, like your life isn’t like increased like by anything. Like you literally, you aren’t gonna get happier by having all this money. So that’s what confuses me because like I sit there and I’m like, if I have all this money, the moment I have [00:26:00] everything that I need, my comforts met, my home, my car, all this, all that extra money is extra money to go to shows, to go to art, to go to whatever it needs to. I don’t understand the idea of hoarding it. Like that’s just weird to me.
AMD: It is very weird and I don’t know what that is about either. And if it’s like power or like a sense of like needing to have control and then I start to wonder if these things are like built into our DNA and some of us have like the wherewithal to overcome that.
And to like reject that type of power because we are aware of it and understand it. Whereas like I wonder if we’re just like kind of, I don’t know, this is like totally philosophical and the stuff that keeps me up at night, but like were we just like born into this way of mentality and then you grow out of it and some people don’t like, I don’t know.
It’s wild to me too, like why do you need $250 billion? Why?
I,
ViVi: there’s like, I don’t get it. You can’t even [00:27:00] spend that
AMD: seriously. Like literally just give it away. Like so many people need it, just give it away. I can’t wait for the day. I can give away like hundreds of thousands of dollars to other people that would just, that’s like a dream come true.
I don’t need all this money, like you said, like I just need to eat, have a roof over my head, have the things that I need and want for my family, and then like I want to share with everybody else. And. Why aren’t more people like that?
ViVi: Exactly,
AMD: exactly.
ViVi: I
just like, for me, I actually have like a friend who is kind of like that.
She’s also a trans woman and she’s in sex work and all that, and she is the type of girl that literally will do her best to like hand out what she can and she’ll use like her connections with like sugar daddies and stuff like that to help out her girls. And I’m just like, that is, that is the goal. Like whenever I did sex work, I was like, that is what I would love to be like, who I would love to grow into.
So yeah. [00:28:00]
AMD: Yeah. That’s awesome. What kind of fun things do you do with your friends in la? Like where do y’all go and hang out and like.
ViVi: So right now, like a lot of us, if we have gigs, we’ll try to meet up and support each other through our gigs. And that’s also a fun way of hanging out because we’re at a bar, we’re at a club.
We just get to do our thing party. Um, every so often we’ll go get like something to eat. Food is just so like healing it, it brings people together. So, um, Korean barbecue, like hot pot, things like that I love doing-. Um, we do love going to like Dave and Buster’s. We have like a little family arcade nearby gaming and stuff.
Oh, and another thing that I love is that we love video gaming. So like a lot of us will be at home and we still play games like Fortnite and Marvel rivals together and like, these are other performers and like people, and I’m like, I love that. I love that we can still be like so close and have so many like fun [00:29:00] memories made by just gaming and yelling at each other.
It’s just so really, so fun.
AMD: Yeah.
ViVi: But
yeah, and it would be nicer to like go on like trips and do all these, but like I love these small moments that I have with my friends.
AMD: Yeah. Have you go, do you go to the desert ever?
ViVi: Um, I actually haven’t, I need to, I need to go out that way. Um, I actually do need to explore LA a lot more.
I’ve just been so busy building a foundation for myself that like, it’s been hard to balance, like going outside of LA a lot.
AMD: Yeah. I hear that.
ViVi: I know. I went back to perform again in San Francisco and that’s my second time and I love it. I am just now getting to explore California and all that, so. I’ve heard great things about Palm Springs in the desert though.
AMD: Oh
yeah. And Joshua Tree. Oh my god. It’s stunning.
ViVi: My friends
were literally just there.
AMD: Yeah,
because it’s, for me, it was like driving around LA and I was like, I just don’t wanna read another fucking sign. Like [00:30:00] stop advertising to me. And that’s why I love the desert. ’cause it’s like not jam packed with messaging, you know? And it’s so quiet and it’s nature. Um, yeah, it’s really beautiful. If you can get a chance to go out there, I highly recommend it.
Yeah.
ViVi: What’s crazy is, uh, that reminds me of my hometown in Fayetteville, Arkansas, because we have an ordinance where we can’t have billboards and stuff within the, the city. Oh. So you don’t see any signs. And there’s like also another one where there’s like 50% tree, like there has to be 50% green. So it’s just lush and I’m- I love that. Like there’s a place in California where it’s like desert and like just all that ’cause it, that reminds me of home. Yeah. Like whenever I like leave and get, and also when I go to suburban areas here in California, I’ll like see like those highway crossings and I’m like, oh, that’s very south.
AMD: So what was it like living in Arkansas and being in the south?
ViVi: So, um, what it was like was very slow. Like I said. Um, people were tight knit [00:31:00] together.
Um. A lot of like judgements whenever you don’t fit the mold. But what I liked about it was since it was slow, like I could get across town in like 10 minutes, 15 minutes on a slow day, like I could go visit my friend in a moment. Like getting to my job at like IHOP back then was like very easy. Um. I did love the greenery.
I, me and my best friend, um, like that I said my gay husband, he’s also from Arkansas, and we would go hiking a little bit. We would go to the spot where we would sit, um, next to the, um, to like Beaver Lake and we would just, I. Look out on the water and smoke and like sit on this rock that was like jutted out.
Mm. And it was just so, it was such a vibe. I remember dropping my phone in that water.
AMD: Oh no.
ViVi: And jumping down and grabbing it like we had, like it was memories, girl. Like it was, it was a cute time. It was fun. But like, what I love about the city is just that it’s so fast and that it’s so much and so the connections, people have so much [00:32:00] more art and stuff.
But like, ’cause the funny thing about Arkansas was like the party spot was Dixon Street, which is the strip of street right next to the college, and it’s just a bunch of bars and restaurants and there was like. Two, like two, three gay clubs like 10 years ago, 15 years ago. And now there’s like one like,
AMD: oh no.
ViVi: I’m like, goodness gracious girls. I’m like, there might be more, but like, mm-hmm. Um, I just haven’t been back. But I remember when I left there was like one and um. Yeah, I’m like, I would sometimes go drink at a sports bar and we did have one bar that had like ice shots, so that was interesting. And you could just throw ’em on the ground after you took your shot.
So yeah, there were some fun things to do. Bowling was popular, which tells you a lot about. The town if bowling is popular. Um, yeah, yeah.
AMD: Yes
it does. Yeah. LA is just like so full of things to do. It’s really, really a fun place. So I’m guessing you love it.
ViVi: Oh, I love it here. Yeah, there’s, [00:33:00] I literally just did the Renaissance Fair last, this last weekend.
I’m like the fact that, like, I have not done any of that in Arkansas just because like, it’s a little bit more scarce. I know they have it, but like coming to, uh, California and there’s like that, there’s. Like all these festivals, all these like little events. It’s, I live next to Hollywood, so there’s always filming and stuff going on.
Yeah, it’s just so fun.
AMD: I love it. We’re gonna take a quick break. We’ll be right back. I.
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AMD: And we’re back. Uh, we’re here with ViVi Fierce talking about all the things. Um, I love it. So let’s ask this. I wanna know, um, what are some of the biggest misconceptions people still hold about trans workers, especially people doing the work to survive?
ViVi: I think a lot of the biggest myths are that trans people don’t take care of their health, that they’re disgusting and that they’re gross.
Um, trans people, like our insurance covers, prep covers doxy covers like so much, especially whenever you’re homeless or poor. So I’m like, trans people are some of the most like, like UpToDate people with like their health and like all that from what I’ve like noticed and even like when I run into people who are like struggling.
Like that’s the one thing that they focus on. So that’s a misconception. I think another misconception is that trans sex workers are desperate. I’m [00:35:00] like, at the end of the day, there’s plenty of, there’s plenty of trade, there’s plenty, plenty of dl. There’s plenty of men out there that are looking for the dolls baby.
The dolls, like the. We love the girls, but there are men out there that want the dolls, and that is just a big misconception that a lot of people have. So people really think that like they’re just dirty and desperate and that the reality of it is, is that so many trans women that I know who are in it are like literally just.
On top of their like, shit, like they’re usually like really smart about what to do, how to navigate, but yeah.
AMD: Yeah. Can, can I share something about where I live locally?
ViVi: Yeah.
AMD: Okay. So I live in a rural area. Um, it’s a more lean conservative than it does progressive. Um, but there’s a mix. But anyways, the-
It’s, um, not very diverse around here. And my friend, he was visiting and he has a Grindr account and he was, [00:36:00] when he was here, staying with us, showing us on the Grindr account, all of these men who were looking for trans sex workers or looking for trans hookups and that they also were cross-dressing in their private life and in their real life they’re just walking around like totally a hundred percent in the closet with kids and a wife anding, and it just kind of blew me away. The large number of like straight, white, cis, het men were like, not what they are, you know, trying to make the world perceive them to be, and it was, it was just a really interesting perspective to see that.
So I’m guessing like that’s something you come across as well as a trans sex worker, like probably people who really wanna keep things private. Is that something that you’ve come across a lot?
ViVi: Of course. Yeah. And like, what’s crazy is living [00:37:00] in, um, LA and living in Arkansas, the profiles are blank in the south, like the profiles are blank and they don’t have information.
AMD: Right.
ViVi: But here in LA people post their photos, their bios, their, they’ll post their job, they don’t care. They’ll post their Instagram. But like, and it makes it so much easier, but like, there. Yeah, like people really do leave nothing and you don’t know who you’re talking to. And that’s what I hate about it is ’cause like whenever I was in the south or whenever I was traveling there and I would open Grindr and some of the photos these men would send to me, I would just be like, what cis woman is giving you attention?
Do you really think that I’m gonna give you attention? I need you to be so serious, ma’am.. I’m like, you’re asking to come over and have me do your makeup and then us have sex and you expect me to do that for free. I’m like, baby, give me $500 and you’re not getting sex. I’m like, you went home with a mug, girl, you can go to the club after you [00:38:00] come to my place after you pay me.
But that’s crazy. I didn’t like it. Yeah, I didn’t like it at all
AMD: for free.
What’s that about,
ViVi: right?
AMD: Hell no.
ViVi: I’m, I’m gonna just be honest ’cause like I love. I don’t consider cross dressers really a part of the LGBT co community because it’s straight men. Yeah. Doing that. So I say same. This probably I dislike a CD so much, I’m not really into them or like that because it’s just so like that’s kink.
It’s a kink. Mm-hmm. And I can sit there and. Like, be comfortable saying that. Like, I’m not interested in that kink and I’m a kink shame a little because that’s a kink of mine. And so don’t k shame me for kink shaming because that’s my kink. And um, with that being said, like it’s like that’s what’s so creepy about it, is that they look at trans women and stuff and they think that like, we want to partake.
And I’m like, girl, like. Like this is like me with barely any makeup on, with just throwing on my hair and stuff. I’m like, I’m living as [00:39:00] a woman, a femme queen, like I am just doing my thing like
AMD: femme queen.
ViVi: That’s just so, it’s just so cringey to me. Yeah, but you know what? As long as you do, as long as you keep it on that app and behind your door, do you?
Right? Yeah.
Yeah,
totally.
AMD: What was that you just said
ViVi: Femme Queen.
AMD: Yes. Yes.
ViVi: Because like I’m also in the ballroom community, so, um, a lot of like trans women will also go by femme queen.
But basically the term is fem queen and I’m in ballroom and that’s what a lot of, um, trans women will call themselves.
That’s the category. Whenever they call for femme queens, they’re calling for trans women. So,
yeah.
AMD: Okay. That’s awesome. That’s good to know. Thank you. So just, I just wanna ask a couple more things. Um, yeah. You mentioned wanting people to scroll through your Instagram to get the real story, the real story about.
You. What do you think that Instagram tells viewers That [00:40:00] words can’t say?
ViVi: I think that my Instagram whenever, because when I said that, like, I definitely don’t mean like my in personal like day-to-day life because that’s very different than my social presence. But what, what, what I think that people will get from my Instagram story when they see it is that like I am a big girl.
I am a trans girl and I’m a woman of color and I am out here showing myself, being out there like being so proud, like. Some of my photos were like, it’s like at some clubs in WeHo, you’ll see people in the back like mean mugging or disgusted, and I, and then the other half are living, and I’m just like, that’s why I do it.
And that’s what my, that’s what my Instagram store, uh, profile says. It says that like no matter what this girl is going to go out there and do and put on a show, put on a look, do her thing, whether it’s in ballroom, whether it’s in drag, go-go stripping. I literally did a dance gig like last month, [00:41:00] and I threw this string bikini on.
Like, because I was being lazy and I was kind of worried I was gonna look kind of like crazy ’cause like a lot of body in a string bik-, but keep girl, those are some of the best photos I’ve ever taken. I’m like, whoa. I’m like, so you really just gotta like, that’s what it tells, that’s what it says.
AMD: I
love that.
I love it. And what message do you want other trans folks, especially those who are still living in the south or dealing with instability, what do you want them to hear or learn from your journey?
ViVi: I want them to know that if you really want it, you can get it. Because in this life we have free will and we forget that.
And like, I literally remember I tried saving up and I second saving up money, so when a friend said, you can stay with me for a month or two, I jumped on it with no money and I went and I just, I wanted it. And so like, it’s hard to sit there and make [00:42:00] sacrifices, but also at the same time, I look at where I’m at now.
Yeah. And I’m very happy I made those decisions. Yeah. I’m very happy that like, um, I went and I chose myself over being comfortable over being, um, safe and all those things.
AMD: Yeah,
ViVi: and I think that that’s what I want other trans women in the South and in like hard situations or any type of hardships that like you can choose you.
AMD: Yeah. I love that. Thank you so much. Can you tell everyone where to find you if they want to follow you or, yeah. Do you have any projects coming up or anything you want people to know about?
ViVi: So, um, basically you could find me at, um, ViVi S Fierce on Instagram. That’s gonna be the main area where you can find me.
Um, it’s got my email for bookings. Um, it’s got ballroom, um, like videos, images, it’s got dancing stuff. Basically my portfolio, um, I’m [00:43:00] kind of like, it also has all my other links to like all the things, but all those other social medias are just kind of like, like passive, and I am not really on it like that.
Yeah. Um, I will say that I am performing at, um, Trantisy Island, which is, um, on June 1st. It’s gonna be like this pool party weekend that centers around trans folks and stuff. Um, I’m super excited about that.
AMD: Yeah. Um, that’s
awesome.
ViVi: But
yeah, like there’s no like really big projects. Coming up. All I know is, is that, like on my profile, um, there’s gonna be some amazing like pics that I’ve taken
AMD: nice.
ViVi: Um, with like, um, some photographer friends that are gonna be dropping soon. And I am gagging at like the level that like I am jumping to because I would love to like really jump into like the modeling and stuff because like I do the dancing and things in person, but. Yeah, that’s kind of,
AMD: I love it.
ViVi: Where you can find me, where you can see me, where you can book me.
AMD: Yasss. Book her. Yasss.
ViVi: Right. Yeah. Like I said, if you really [00:44:00] wanna support the Trans Girls and the Dolls and the Fem Queens
AMD: a hundred percent
ViVi: book us. Or you could just pay us, like you could just find my cash app, in my DM, and you could send me $2,000 and I will literally,
AMD: I love that mentality.
ViVi: Yeah. Right?
AMD: Yasss.
Amazing. This has been such a pleasure and an honor. Thank you so much for spending time with us and like sharing your experiences, your journey, your knowledge. Um, we we’re just so happy to have you. So thank you for being here.
ViVi: And um, I just wanna say thank you so much for having me. I had a blast. It’s always fun getting to talk about myself.
I love whenever people let me yap about myself. I’m like, that’s why take me on a date one day and I can yap about myself even more.
I love it. I love it. Well, thanks again and have a great day out there.
You too.
AMD: Hi Daisy. Hi. Did you enjoy listening?
Daisy: Yes. Yeah. ViVi is amazing.
AMD: I know. So full of life and [00:45:00] spirit and beauty.
Daisy: Yeah,
AMD: just resilience. Amazing. Um, yeah, it’s such a crazy time in the world,
Daisy: yeah, I did take a look at this, uh, Swedish law.
AMD: Oh, perfect.
Daisy: To
clarify real quick.
AMD: Okay, great.
Daisy: Um, it is Nordic model, so even though like the content itself is illegal, they’re not punishing the actual sex workers, but, um,
AMD: okay.
Daisy: But everyone else involved, including the buyers and the landlords and the platforms are all liable and um,
AMD: okay. So still bad
also, yeah.
Daisy: Also, it seems like it, they may still be allowed to subscribe to content.
They just can’t request anything custom.
AMD: Okay.
Daisy: So like OnlyFans is allowed as long as you’re not requesting any custom. Like do this for me.
AMD: I see.
Daisy: Which is [00:46:00] strange.
AMD: Yeah, I get, I mean, it’s still bad. I mean, it’s just, it’s ’cause it’s like, it’s like, see, it’s not that bad. It’s like that’s how they’re framing it.
You know what I mean? And for like the movement. Yeah. Like the people who aren’t us and don’t understand that that’s still really bad. Like people, I would just wonder if people are like, oh, like actually that sounds like a good thing. Do you know what I mean?
Daisy: Yeah. I think, I think that’s what’s happening here, and that’s kind of how the Nordic model is traditionally used is like, oh, see, we’re not coming after the sex workers.
They might be exploited and it kind of
AMD: a hundred percent because they’re trying to do this. Like, let’s save you thing, let’s save you from it. Mm-hmm. Um, that is very interesting and good to know. Thank you for clarifying that. Because like kind of the messaging that I’m seeing, it’s like, kind of led me to believe, which is why I was like googling specific questions, but it kind of made me think like, oh, they banned porn.
Daisy: Yeah. And the way that media reports on these things can be a little,
AMD: of course,
Daisy: [00:47:00] sensationalist
AMD: of course. And a part of me feels like they’re just again, like just chipping away. You know? Mm-hmm. And like, what are they gonna do next? Mm-hmm. You know? So, um, thank you so much for clarifying that for, for me and the audience.
I, I appreciate that. Awesome. Well, I think that is a close for this recording session. Daisy, thank you so much for being here with me today.
Daisy: Yeah, thank you. That was an awesome conversation.
AMD: It was, it was. Very cool. And to all of our listeners, please don’t forget to rate, review and subscribe. That really helps.
Us and uh, yeah, there’s a couple of messages at the end of us talking, so hope you enjoy today’s session. Bye.
Daisy: See you next time.